Need advice before I lay down the money

[redleg105]

I looked at an M1D that had the following stamps on the side of the barrel: SA7312553 1-53 A208A

Is it correct?

[RDS]

Barrel drawing number should end in 555 not 553. Correct M1D barrel number is D7312555. Be advised repro M1D scope mounting barrel blocks have been available for over 30 yrs. Same can be said of M1D scope mounts.

[Orlando]

Even a rifle that has all original USGI parts and correct barrel does not make it authentic M1D
A M1D without documentation is only worth the sum of parts.

[redleg105]

I have found the following:
http://www.parttarget.com/Army-Unite...3_6221301.html
http://www.parttarget.com/1005-00-73...3-F8676A16E5D4
https://issuu.com/survivit/docs/tm-9...aint-with-r/64
page 62 lists that part number

[Orlando]

I have found the following:
http://www.parttarget.com/Army-Unite...3_6221301.html
http://www.parttarget.com/1005-00-73...3-F8676A16E5D4
https://issuu.com/survivit/docs/tm-9...aint-with-r/64
page 62 lists that part number

what???????????????????????

[lapriester]

If the rifle has no documentation it's a crap shoot whether it's original, correct or even genuine at all. As far as the barrel, it needs to have a "555" suffix in the part number under the rear hand guard. Even if it does it doesn't mean the rifle is an original M1D. Buying M1D's is complicated since there are no existing records of what rifles were converted. Thus, without DCM or CMP documentation you could just be buying someone's backyard shop conversion built with an original barrel.

[RDS]

Back in the early 1990s or late 1980s Samco in Fla. imported a small batch of legit M1Ds from Israel. Check the rifle over very carefully for a Samco import marks. At this same time Sarco in NJ imported form Israel a small batch of legit M1D barrels. Also check the scope. If possible remove the scope from the mount. A lot of M84 scopes were reconstructed from demilled M84 scopes. They are spliced in the middle of the scope and the seem is hidden when the scope is in the mount. Also check under the windage and elevation caps for stamped letters I believe they are LK, KK or just a single K. The gentleman that rebuilt M84 scopes stamped them there. His work was excellent. Also on a side note all the spare parts and tubes the were left in the Libby Owens Ford plant in Ohio were sold off in the 1990s. It was a very large amount of parts. A number of scopes were assembled from the parts and tubes but I can not remember the number. So as lapriester says its a crap shoot as to it being original unless of course it has CMP docs stating its a M1D.

[m1sniper]

Back in the early 1990s or late 1980s Samco in Fla. imported a small batch of legit M1Ds from Israel. Check the rifle over very carefully for a Samco import marks. At this same time Sarco in NJ imported form Israel a small batch of legit M1D barrels. Also check the scope. If possible remove the scope from the mount. A lot of M84 scopes were reconstructed from demilled M84 scopes. They are spliced in the middle of the scope and the seem is hidden when the scope is in the mount. Also check under the windage and elevation caps for stamped letters I believe they are LK, KK or just a single K. The gentleman that rebuilt M84 scopes stamped them there. His work was excellent. Also on a side note all the spare parts and tubes the were left in the Libby Owens Ford plant in Ohio were sold off in the 1990s. It was a very large amount of parts. A number of scopes were assembled from the parts and tubes but I can not remember the number. So as lapriester says its a crap shoot as to it being original unless of course it has CMP docs stating its a M1D.

IIRC, the LK initials were Les Kraft out of NJ.. Tony Pucci of Orion7 used to sell these scopes shortly after he "popped up" on the M1 scene.. The workmanship as far as the splicing together was real good, all you would see is a super, super fine goldish (braze) hair like line around the scope tube that like said above would be hidden by the M1D scope mount. One problem that did arise from these re-milled (if that's even a word), it was found that the adjustments would either not work at all, or not work correctly on several of the rebuilt scopes.. I know a few folks that bought them back in the day. 2 of them were not happy campers at all as their adjustments didn't work. I don't remember if those 2 ever got a refund.

As far as using the repro M1D scope blocks, don't waste your time. Years ago I had come across a 6 groove M1 barrel. It was a rebuilt de-milled barrel using an M1 chamber and a ??? 03A3 or M1917 Enfield barrel. Got the lowdown from Bill Ricca and was told who it was that used to do that work. I forget who it was tho. Anyway, since it didn't have "collector" value, I chose to have a real good local machine shop "turn down" the chamber and press fit a repro barrel block from Numrich on.
1st time at the range I could not sight it in. Had 4 friends that day, 2 sat on the spotting scopes they had, one using binoculars, and the last one had a 14" Celestron telescope. Shooting at 600 yrds, no one could spot my hits. The friend with the binocs happened to take them away from his eyes and noticed bullet strikes in the dirt at about 50 yards. Made every adjustment possible with the scope (a good M84) and best I could accomplish was to hit the dirt out to about 80 yrds.
Those repro blocks are cheap garbage and won't be concentric with your barrel unless you have a master machinist do a lot of work to it all.
BTW, ended up giving that barrel to the gunsmith/friend at our local shop, he pulled the barrel block and installed it on one of his Blue Sky import rifles and the sucker shot real good with irons!!

[MarkS]

Folks I need some help on a rifle in my dad's collection.
The rifle does not have the feel of something built recently. Plus, it is a tack driver (or rather destroys skull sized rocks at 300 yds scoped and if your eyes can still use peep sites)
It is a M1C pattern with the pronged flash hider and side mount scope system.
Springfield Armory is stamped across the top of the rear of the receiver.
Serial number is 3676495. This is well below the later 1982 mfg serial numbers
The rifle was purchased in the M1C configuration back in the late 80s (used).
The entire rifle, scope, and mount appear to be full mil spec...
The scope looks like it might have had a dull shine finish, the rifle has a mat finish on both metal and wood.
When I started this quest, I thought it was something simple.
What items/numbers do I need to look for?

[RDS]

Please post photos. What do you mean by 1982 mfg. serial numbers? The serial number of the M1 Garand are stamped on the receiver heel.

[MarkS]

The 1982 serial number reference is from a Wiki article on commercial production

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1_Garand#Springfield_Armory_commercial_production

When your refer to the receiver heel, is that the rear upper area of the receiver? I ask because every site has their idea of "official" firearms nomenclature.
As I said earlier the serial number is 3676495, and it is stamped on the upper rear of the receiver.

What I would appreciate is a downloadable, pictorial reference that allows me start the process of yea or nay on the history and authenticity of the rifle. I've seen references to brazed scope tubes, demilled receivers welded, etc. Many are vague and lack a source I can backtrack.

I'll be happy to submit pictures at a later date (the rifle is 200 miles away) after I've done a bit of research. I'd rather not get slammed by the forum.

Hopefully I didn't make a mistake on starting my research with this forum.
If my questions are in the wrong area, please point me to the right subject block.
I'm a shooter, not a collector. Any assistance is appreciated.

[jak]

Springfield Armory and Springfield Armory INC. are completely two different companies. Don't not confuse the two of them. The original Springfield Armory closed around 1968. S/A INC started making commercially manufactured gararnds beginning with the 7 mil S/N. You receiver was manufactured in April of 1945.
Also, please explain why you think you are getting slammed.

[RDS]

Mark
Sorry if you felt slammed. But photos answer a lot of questions. The serial number of your fathers weapon is interesting as it falls in a vague general serial range for a M1C. This does not mean it is a legit M1C, as only a examination could do that. Photos of the scope and mount would be very helpful. Many so called M1Cs were assembled from parts by individuals. The US military destroyed many thousands of M1 Garands by shear cutting the receiver in halve thru the mid sections. Theses shear cut receivers were than sold as scrap metal to the highest bidder. Enterprising individuals in 1960s purchased the scrapped receivers and welded front and rear half together and machined the receivers into "functional" receivers. They are referred to as " rewelds". The heel of the receiver is the area of the receiver to the rear of the rear sight. The receiver legs are the left and right side of the receiver that slide into the stock. On the front of the right leg are numbers and symbols. They denote the receiver drawing number (blueprint) with revision number. The other symbols and numbers are heat lot numbers. When you get a chance to submit photos please make sure to include photos of these numbers. Also located on the right leg you may find electro pencil etchings if the weapon went thru an arsenal rebuild program. Feel free to pm me if you have questions or comments you rather not post on line.

[m1sniper]

Hi Mark, this is confusing>

This is well below the later 1982 mfg serial numbers.

1st Q from me is this: Is the receiver stamped on the flat part of the back of the receiver right near the back of the rear sight? If yes, is it SA- 52 marked or is is marked 1982 ??? If it's marked SA-52, that is a rifle that was rebuilt by the original Springfield Armory in 1952, and many M1 rifles including M1C snipers did go thru rebuilds and were marked SA-52. Please let us know so we can go from there.