Some questions about a Navy Trophy Garand

[lp1911]

Hi, I recently bought a Navy Trophy Garand MK2 Mod1 grade B, with all the paperwork, but as I tried to clean it I ran into a few issues, that I was hoping to find out more about.
1. There is no gap between the front handguard ferrule and the gas cylinder, seems like they are attached to each other?
2. The front handguard is immobile with respect to the front ferrule and the lower band, again seems to be glued in and there is not metal insert along the bottom of the front handguard
3. The lower band has no pin connecting it to the barrel, one can see a corner of the barrel through the pin hole, so it is not aligned by at least 1 or 2 mm
4. The rear handguard does shift back and forth a couple millimeters
5. When I unscrewed the gas plug there was some serious carbon build up, so I cleaned it as best I could as I was afraid to take off the gas cylinder (seems like it's on incredibly tight or glued/welded on in the back, but it is flush against the ferrule). After cleaning I was curious to measure the gas cylinder and the 0.528" gauge pin would not go through, perhaps it is slightly undersized or I did not clean it well enough. The pin would stop at the shoulder. The gas piston is exactly 0.525, so maybe it's ok...


All of this is not what I am use to with Garands, but it is supposed to be an accurized version and I could not find much detailed information, hope someone here can help.

[Smokey]

I'm pretty sure the lower band should be pinned in place, and the forward handguard should not be in contact with the gas cylinder. I would disassemble it with care, removing the gas cylinder by gently tapping it straight forward with a non-marring plastic hammer, or piece of wood. While it's apart you should inspect for and remove any rust or corrosion, then coat every metal item with a thin film of grease. Apply a little more grease in all the many places that need lubrication internally, You should only have to do this once.
Here's a good reference for lubrication: Greasing the M1 Garand (garandgear.com)
Some folks will scream bloody murder about taking an accurized rifle apart, but many have found corrosion internally when they did, and often the rifles weren't properly lubricated. It needs to be done, but only rarely. Fact is they were at least field-stripped for maintenance occasionally if they got heavy use with frequent competition shooting.

[Smokey]

There's a lot of good information available here: M1 Garand Tutorials (garandgear.com)M1 Garand Tutorials (garandgear.com)

[Orlando]

Stop!! The front hand gaurd is probably screwed and glued to the lower band, the lower band and front handguard will come out in one piece. Never pick up the rifle by the front hand gaurd and
throw those gas cylinder PIN gages away. Only accurate way to measure gas cylinder is with the Ordnance type gage

[Smokey]

Orlando, you gave a proper warning about the front handguard being joined to the barrel band. That is a fragile part of the accurizing process. The rifle still needs to be disassembled to be fixed, and it needs to be protected from corrosion, lubricated and properly reassembled with the barrel band pinned to the barrel.
You probably will never need to disassemble it like that again.

[lp1911]

Thank you all for your advice. The front handguard is indeed attached to the lower band by screws. During the first time out with the rifle, I had one case of short stroking. Also after shooting, as there was no pin, the front handguard assembly ended up with a bit of a lateral wobble. So VERY gently, using a copper small hammer, I tapped the whole front handguard assembly away from the gas cylinder until the hole aligned with the barrel cut-out and pinned it. Of course that ended up with a more normal gap between the cylinder and the front handguard assembly. I then cleaned the gas cylinder as thoroughly as possible without removing it, after which the 0.528" pin did just barely go through with a bit of pressure (cleaning out absolutely all that crud would be a VERY long procedure). Also the gas cylinder lock is the type that threads on until about 5:30 and has to be wrenched into place, so I am not going to try to take off the gas cylinder. I remeasured the gas piston and it is a bit undersized at 0.5248+/-0.00005, but then the cylinder is rather tight, so perhaps all is good since my next trip to the range yesterday using the same ammo resulted in no short stroking in over 100 rounds.

[TJT]

Torqueing on the cylinder lock is not a good thing. It puts stress in places there should not be any stress. An ideal fit for the lock is 6:00 with no torque.
Jon

[lp1911]

Torqueing on the cylinder lock is not a good thing. It puts stress in places there should not be any stress. An ideal fit for the lock is 6:00 with no torque.
Jon

I would agree, but odds of a lock that goes to exactly 6:00 are rather low, most would be over or under. The question is what is considered close enough to be wrenched the last little bit vs turning back a bit. I have read some places where people like to have to wrench it that last 1/24th of a turn or less, but don’t know why. In this case, this is how it was originally set up, and based on the wall of crud that formed behind the gas plug/screw it was set up like this by whoever accurized it.

[Orlando]

gas locks were not timed when rifles were originally built,a lock was grabbed of the pile and turned on

[lp1911]

gas locks were not timed when rifles were originally built,a lock was grabbed of the pile and turned on

Very true, but they were not accurized either with all the changes found in these kinds of rifles. The objective was to field weapons that were accurate enough for battle, not clover leaf groups on a target.

[Smokey]

The gas cylinder should never be turned down tight against the forward handguard. Either the handguard is a little "rattle loose" or there's some space with an accurized rifle. Generally I turn the gas cylinder lock back up to align with the gas cylinder. If the cylinder has been pushed down until it's tight against the handguard, the gas cylinder plug will pull it it away to give some clearance when tightened.

By the way, I hope you thoroughly greased your riffle when reassembling it. A dry Garand will malfunction and be damaged in use.

[Orlando]

One summer I spent countless rounds and hours experimenting with timing of various gas locks and accuracy. My findings were gas locks made zero affect on accuracy except if you cranked one down to tight. A to tight gas lock and accuracy went south

[lp1911]

One summer I spent countless rounds and hours experimenting with timing of various gas locks and accuracy. My findings were gas locks made zero affect on accuracy except if you cranked one down to tight. A to tight gas lock and accuracy went south

Are you recommending that I turn it back nearly a full turn and then screw in the gas plug? This wasn't much cranking it was very close to 6:00, but did need to be wrenched the last bit...

[Orlando]

Crank with fingers or a wrench? If with a wrench how far off? 5:25?

[lp1911]

Crank with fingers or a wrench? If with a wrench how far off? 5:25?

Around 5:25 and not fingers, I used the aluminum "wrench" that I use to hold the gas lock when torqueing the gas screw. I tapped it with a plastic hammer so as not to go past 6:00.
When I was originally trying to unscrew it, I had to use the same wrench as well, it was really on tight.